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November 13, 2003
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:iconahmednayyer:
I like AMD (Advanced Micro Devices) for their spirit to compete against hardware giant intel.

Athlon XP is much faster than Pentium 4 with a reasonable price.

Used by serious multimedia artists, music composers and gamers today, best motherboards to support Athlon XP are from ASUS Inc, Taiwan.

This deviation is free to use in your projects for promotion of AMD.


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:iconcoyoteseige:
I use AMD because it's affordable for people on a budget. I run a Athlon X2 7850

--
Coyote's Ramblings.... :pride:
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:iconliger0schnider:
Im Still using the Skt754 Version of the Athlon 64 3000+ It still runs the latest games at a reasonable rate. Go AMD!

--
Joshua TA Foster
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:iconnutzelfutz:
So you work for AMD, huh...
No offense, but this kind of stuff and comment should be posted in a PC forum, not here. There's no art in bashing specific companies, and if you like AMD, then work for them, use their stuff, sell it, but don't put advertisements on this site...
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:iconahmednayyer:
There are many deviations here that have a company name in it, we live in a world of brands, artists themselves use various brands for their colors, brushes, pencils and even paper!

deviantART encourages an enabling and open environment, if you have any complains you may contact deviantART help desk.

"There's no art in bashing specific companies" can you explain your statement?

Artists work for companies to earn their living.

The next day somebody like you will come to my page and will say I should remove all the automobiles illustrations because those are badged as Mercedes-Benz, Buick, Ford, Austin, MG, and BMW.

I am already working for AMD, I am lucky using their stuff, and I have sell it too, my work is not an advertisement by any means, its just a logo.

You are not an admin or part of staff at deviantART, so you should take your own seat and quit telling people what and what not to do.

deviantART is itself a good company and there is much going on to promote it. I like it.

- Ahmed Nayyer

--
Art is the triumph over chaos. - John Cheever
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:iconnutzelfutz:
Hi again.
Seems you took this a little too personal. I wasn't criticising your wallpapers or something like that. They're fine. In fact, the cars look great, and I would never complain about them. I'm not trying to act like an administrator. The Help Desk is used for reporting serious racist or similar offending issues. The only issue I have is the way you commented your submissions.
Be warned, though. The explanation might take a little longer.
In my opinion, although they have great processors, AMD isn't better than Intel. Its not like AMD is a 'Robin Hood' kind of company fighting an evil empire led by Intel. They're on equal terms, and the reason AMD processors were less common in the past is because they mainly copied Intel CPUs until the release of the Pentium 1, not because they were held down by Intel. I own(ed) PCs built with Intel as well as AMD CPUs, and they have advantages and disadvantages. Usually, Intel PCs perform better with music and video encoding, and AMD PCs are better for gaming. Intel CPUs need ridiculous amounts of power, and the AMD rigs tend to overheat. Implying 'AMD is better in any way' and 'Intel strips its customers of their money' is just unfair. Yes, AMD processors can be cheaper, and they have, for example, paved the road to 64bit computing in the consumer market, but they also have made design choices in the past that reduced reliability, performance or durability, such as the lack of a heat spreader on their chips or too small L2 cache sizes or the omission of internal heat detection. So 'Athlon XP is much faster than Pentium 4 when comparing models of the same price range' would sound better to ME, or 'AMD chips offer excellent performance for low-cost computers'.
Feel free to comment about my current rigs, they were built shortly after the release of the CPUs used in them:
a) DELL Dimension 8200, P4 2.4GHZ Northwood, 512 MB PC800-40 RDRAM, 2x 40 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200rpm, DELL board with Intel i850 chipset, nVidia geForce 420MX, Win98SE, used for graphics design.
b) self-built, AMD Sempron 3100+ Palermo e6, 1024 MB PC3200 DDR-RAM Kingston, 80 GB Seagate Barracuda 7200rpm, Asus K8N-E board with nVidia nForce 3 chipset, nVidia GeForce 6600GT 128bit 128MB, Kubuntu Linux EdgyEft, mainly used for software testing.
c) self-built, P4 3.2GHZ HT Northwood, 1024 MB PC3200 DDR-RAM Kingston Dual-Channel, 80 GB Seagate Barracuda SATA, Intel 875PBZ board with i875 chipset, ATI Radeon9800pro 256bit 128MB, Windows XP Home SP2, used for gaming.
If you take a closer look, you'll see that above Intel PCs were extremely fast when I bought them, and AMD processors that could compete with them were released several months later. After the release of the Athlon 64, though, Intel CPUs sucked, for years. Only with the release of the Core2Due/Quad processor architecture, Intel CPUs seem to be of some value now.
Please, do tell me your opinion. It's rare to find a person that actually KNOWS someting about processors, and it really pleases me.
Greetings
nutzelfutz
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:iconahmednayyer:
The following is based on valid references, and its not a story written by me.

First, consider that Intel has a revenue of $35.7 billion USD, net income of $5 billion USD, aprox 94,000 employees and more than 11 plants.

AMD on the other hand, has a revenue of just $7.471 billion USD, net income of just $574 million which is going down steeply, aprox 16,000 employees and 1 plant.

- 1. Thus, there is no comparison between Intel and AMD ground realities, i.e. on resources.

- 2. Yet, one's prodcuts cannot be stated better than the other except for a short period of time, considering AMD has 1 plant compared with Intel's 11, AMD seems to be doing good, everybody knows about it.

- 3. As far as the copying of pre Pentium 8086, 80286, and 80386 are concerned, it must be noted that AMD and Intel were partners at that time, as in February 1982, AMD signed a contract with Intel, becoming a licensed second-source manufacturer of 8086 and 8088 processors. IBM wanted to use the Intel 8088 in its IBM PC, but IBM's policy at the time was to require at least two sources for its chips. AMD later produced the 80286, or 286, under the same arrangement, but Intel canceled the agreement in 1986, and refused to convey technical details of the i386 part.

AMD challenged Intel's decision to cancel the agreement and won in arbitration, but Intel disputed this decision. A long legal dispute followed, ending in 1994 when the Supreme Court of California ordered Intel to pay over $1 billion in compensation for violation of contract.

- 4. In the face of uncertainty, AMD was forced to develop "clean room" versions of Intel code. In this fashion, one engineering team described the function of the code, and a second team without access to the source code itself had to develop microcode that performed the same functionality.

Thus, the simple statement that AMD copied Pre-Pentium processors from Intel is based on a false assumption of facts.

- 5. AMD's first completely in-house x86 processor was the K5 which was launched in 1995. The "K" was a reference to "Kryptonite" which from comic book lore was the only substance that could harm Superman (a clear reference to Intel which was dominant in the market).

- 6. In August 1999, AMD released the Athlon (K7) processor. The Athlon had a novel performance oriented micro-architecture, backed by a powerful FPU. The Athlon attempted to reduce bottlenecks that AMD viewed as inherent in the Intel P6 design. The Athlon had a higher average execution-per-clock throughput. The increased throughput versus the i686#Intel|P6 was possible because of fabrication processes permitting increases in transistor density for the Athlon processor. Early samples of the Athlon had branch prediction problems and lower clock rates than the P6. The final production chips fixed these early problems, and offered performance increases over Intel's architecture.

Intel immediately engaged in a near complete re-design of the P6 core, to eliminate the pipeline stalls that had reduced its performance. The result was the "Coppermine" series. However, the sudden revision and necessary line re-tooling put pressure on Intel's manufacturing facilities. Early availability of Coppermine chips was limited.

By working with Motorola, AMD was able to refine copper interconnect manufacturing to the production stage about one year before Intel. The revised process permitted 180-nanometer processor production. The accompanying die-shrink resulted in lower power consumption, permitting AMD to increase Athlon clock-speeds to the 1 gigahertz range. AMD found processor yields on the new process exceeded expectations, and delivered high speed chips in volume in March 2000. Intel announced a 1-GHz Pentium a few days after AMD did, but was unable to ship the part in volume for several months. Intel's attempt to leapfrog AMD with a 1.13-GHz Pentium III resulted in a product that worked reliably only on certain motherboards and was panned by prominent industry critics.[5] The chip was withdrawn from the market, having been installed in only a handful of OEM systems.[6] A revised stepping of the Intel chip wasn't released until 2001.

- 7. The K8 is a major revision of the K7 architecture, with the most notable features being the addition of a 64-bit extension to the x86 instruction set (called AMD64), the incorporation of an on-chip memory controller, and the implementation of an extremely high performance point to point interconnect called HyperTransport, as part of a Direct Connect Architecture. The Opteron, released on April 22, 2003, was the first product to come out of this architecture. It was followed by the Athlon 64 on September 23, 2003.

It is arguable that at the time of its release 64-bit was not yet needed by mainstream users. However the fact that the architecture offered high performance 32-bit application compatibility made it feasible for home users. It was so popular in fact, that the AMD64 standard was adopted by Microsoft and Sun Microsystems and quickly supported by the GNU/Linux and BSD communities. This left Intel in a position where they were forced to license the AMD64 extensions for their own 64-bit (EM64T) processors and possibly signalling the end for Intel's IA-64 platform.

The K8 is marketed under many names, depending on the targeted end-user: Athlon 64 (and FX), Opteron, Turion 64 and some Semprons are based on the K8. The Opteron is the server version of the K8. AMD designed the Opteron to compete against Intel's IA-64 Itanium architecture, but the failure of the IA-64 project to leverage volume sales means that the Opteron now competes with Intel's AMD64-compatible Xeon processor series.

- It must be noted that AMD released the first dual core x86 server chip as early as April 21, 2005.

From 1995 to 2006, AMD released several technologies to cater its customers and fulfill their needs with different processors for different applications, there are about 9 different processors.

While on the other hand, Intel was producing the same old Netburst based Pentium 4 from 1995 to July 2006, with the same sonic jingle that you have heard so many times.

The so called Pentium D's production was ceased on 9 March 2007. The Core2Due/Quad processor architecture, can have the same fate if Intel is not up to designing something which could offer some comparison for the coming AMD K10.

You see a logo on Microsoft products which says "Designed for Intel Pentium 4" and Intel's products have a logo that says "Designed for Microsoft Windows XP".

The word Athlon is a mistake under Microsoft word, whilst Pentium is a proper word?

AMD has to develop AMD Athlon XP because Windows XP do not support AMD Athlon's features to their full.

Since I left the usage of Intel's products in 2003, I cannot say much about its products, the i850 chipset that you are using for system (a) is very reliable and robust package, I have used it for more than 5 years without problems. I can just advice that you should not use Windows 98 Second Edition for the system listed under (a). Because Windows 98 cannot even understand many of its features, and this OS is highly vulnerable to internet threats. Its good that you're using Seagate's products.

There is nothing like extreme performance when you just speak of MHz and GHz, you must consider software when speaking about speeds, as if you consider that insanity levels on which the automobile industry had once stepped: having created wonderful, powerful, and fast autos, with engines in displacements of thousands of cubic centimeters and as many as 16 cylinders in V formation.

Automobile Manufacturers were surprised to see that there were few places where these autos could have drive at full speed — because autos move on roads, they do not fly. If you compare megabytes of code and data with kilometers of roads, then programs are the roads where CPUs drive. Programs should be optimized, leveled off.

In fact, we live in the era of "engine/cpu power raising" decline. Yes, the sluggish race for gigahertz and teraflops of the peak performance will endure some more time, but the victory communiques like "now 200MHz more!" do not excite the past optimism. Especially when all this results in another poor 2-3% performance gain in real applications. Poorly optimized programs are obviously easier to develop than the well-optimized, so an "external impact" is needed to make programmers obligingly agree to develop good programs. Slowing down of the peak "dull" CPU performance growth will serve as such impact. Thus, accepting the responsibility to dictate their will (or "come out with suggestions" if you please) to hardware designers, programmers in their turn will undertake for using hardware features to full extent.

You can have a look at the current system I use under my scraps [link]

I can also show you the pictures of its assembly if you're interested.


- Ahmed Nayyer

--
Art is the triumph over chaos. - John Cheever
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:iconnutzelfutz:
Whoa...
Neat system you have there...I also see you suffer from too much cables in yout system. I tried to fight that problem, but found no solution up to now...
Currently I'm thinking about building a new gaming rig, using an Intel Core 2 Duo 6600 or 6700, but the need for a DX10 graphics card forces me to wait until errors in the nForce 8800 GPUs are ironed out or ATI products have caught up. I also hope that by then, a legacy-free mainboard with EFI will be released, so I can upgrade to Windows Vista 64, and if it takes even longer, maybe it will be AMD again, depending on their next architecture.
I do not deny the biased use of Wintel products on the market, a fact that I myself found infuriating during the post-Northwood era, as Intel processors were clearly inferior to AMD upperclass CPUs. There IS a serious problem with product placement, also occuring with GPUs and games, where you always find a sticker with 'the way it's meant to be played' or 'designed for', but I think it's mainly a problem for simple-minded people.
I built and used an AMD64 X2 4800+ rig back then, as it proved to be way faster than my other PCs, and my neighbor still uses an AMD Athlon XP 2200+ for his games, outperforming my a) rig in nearly every benchmark except memory-related ones, where mine still benefits from its RDRAM architecture. The reason for using Win98SE on this system (which is used as a stand-alone system not connected to the Internet, thus eliminating virus problems) is that it consumes a very small amount of RAM and HDD space and allows a boot time of under 13 seconds. As I use this system mainly as a music player and for Photoshop 7, I'm fine with Win98. My way of keeping that system stable is not to install unneeded software or hardware, so it ruins very reliable and hasn't caused me any issues in the past 5 years.
Considering the Intel/AMD market situation, it should be considered that not all Intel plants produce CPUs. They also offer , among other, mainboards, integrated graphics and networking devices, so not all their income stems from the CPU division. Also, AMD acquired ATI some time ago, so technically, they own more than one plant, although, just like Intel, they don't use all plants for CPU manufacturing. (The AMD plants (two) are situated in eastern Germany, by the way, so quite some people in my country are involved with them and I would be crazy to wish them bad). I also conider the integration of ATI to be one of the brightest moves in the wohole industry lately, as it allows the perfect integration of various chipset features by one manufacturer.
Concerning the 'copying' of pre-Pentium CPUs: I never said they stole Intel IP. It was a process of licensing and mutual use of technology, but it hindered AMD in developing 'own' IP at that time. In my opinion, the pre-Pentium Pro processors weren't all too well constructed, and instead of building own, more efficient designs, AMD built the same cr*p as Intel, thus crippling their market share. If they had opted to build their own CPUs earlier, perhaps they might have taken Intel's market share by the time the Pentium 2 was released. Well, fortunately, they realized it later on, and thanks to that, they stopped the GHZ hype for good.
The P4 netburst wasn't built from 1995 - 2006, by the way, but I guess that's a typo.
Measuring the performance in GHZ is nonsense, that's for sure. Using your car analogy, it's like comparing the brand-new Bugatti Veyron with 1001 HP to a Mercedes-Benz Unimog with 25 HP, built in the early 1950s. The car is opted for speed and acceleration, thus reaches well over 300 km/h, but it consumes insane amounts of gas and carries 2 people to the max, while the truck is built for work, able to pull over 600 tons when used on a railroad, but with a top speed of around 70 kilometers per hour. It's not so much a question of 'better', but rater of use.
I found my AMD64 to have significant problems when using it for multimedia encoding, despite being far superior to my older systems, so I ended up selling it and using my older systems until I would be able to afford a really stable system. The problem with 64bit CPUs is the lack of software integration. Most software is still designed with 32bit architecture in mind, so I wasn't able to gain a real performance boost with that system, and seeing my uncle's problems with the system (he bought it), I don't miss it much.
By the way...you own some awesome cars. I'm envious. I'm currently working on a rather dented 1965 Vespa Sprint 150, so I think I know how much work was put it them.
Greetings
nutzelfutz
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:iconaforb-anduforme:
BAM :thumbsup:

Looks cool. /uses athlon 64.
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:iconahmednayyer:
Thanks, I use Athlon 64 with MSI K8T Platinun.

Ahmed Nayyer

--
Art is the triumph over chaos. - John Cheever
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:iconforgreatjustice:
This is great! Its not too busy and its the logo of the greatest chip maker in the world! How can you go wrong?
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